8.04.2006
Visiting Hours With Mary
In last weeks post, Physicalism and its Malcontents, I argued that Frank Jackson’s Knowledge Argument against any kind of physicalist account of the mind depended upon an equivocation on the word “knowledge.” Unfortunately, as Richard quickly pointed out, I was at the time unable to flesh out this criticism with all the detail that such a claim merited. In this post I would like to clearly illustrate the two usages of the word “to know” involved in Jackson’s argument as well as provide an argument in support of the assertion that Jackson’s argument against physicalism actually depends on a single usage of the word.
As a recap, Jackson’s knowledge argument is illustrated with the case of Mary the color scientist who is kept from experiencing any colors herself until her release. Jackson’s argument is as follows:
Rather than “knowledge that” as a label for the third person observation of a causal system, I will adopt the new label “propositional knowledge.” This is knowledge which can be called justified true belief. The label which I want to give to the first person participation in a causal system is “experiential knowledge.” It is my contention that this latter type of knowledge is not propositional in its nature, and as such involves nothing which could be considered a belief.
Accordingly, it makes no sense to judge experiential knowledge to be justified or not since it is not propositional in nature. Experiential knowledge can be neither true nor false, and as such does not constitute truths, falsehoods or facts. Clearly, Jackson’s (3) requires that the knowledge which Mary gains upon release contains truths of one kind or another, but this is exactly what a failure to distinguish propositional knowledge from experiential knowledge prevents one from recognizing.
Let us now present a variation on Jackson’s argument:
1’. Mary (before her release) has all propositional knowledge there is to have about other people’s experience of color.
2’. Mary (before her release) does not have all experiential knowledge there is to have about other people’s experience of color (because she gains experiential knowledge upon her release).
3’. There are no truths about other people’s experience of color which escape Mary before her release.
Now of course at this point every dualist will be cringing at the liberties which I have taken with Jackson’s argument. There are a number of areas which must be laid out in far greater detail. First, my argument requires that much of the propositional knowledge which is gained by Mary is non-physical in its nature, thus making my argument entirely beside the point. Second, can we really be sure that no propositional knowledge will be gained upon Mary’s release?
In order to approach the first concern, we must remember that Jackson’s argument is that physicalism cannot be true. Accordingly, my reply to Jackson’s argument is not intended to be an argument for physicalism so much as an argument that physicalism can possibly be true. Consequently, we can be allowed to operate under the assumption that physicalism is in fact true and that mental states are in fact identical to physical states.
In other words, assuming the truth of physicalism, Mary does indeed get to have access to all information regarding other people’s experience of color, including verbal reports. Indeed, assuming physicalism to be true, Jackson’s story would actually require that Mary have access to such reports in order for her to have a complete propositional knowledge of other people’s experience of color. Thus, Mary would indeed know what the experience of color was like in so far as such knowledge can be put in propositional form.
We are now in a position to address the second concern that, as Richard pointed out, “It seems intuitively clear that Mary learns a new fact, namely, what it is like to experience red. She learns that redness looks a certain way.” My response is that inasmuch as there are facts which can be learned, Mary could have learned them while still in captivity by some other medium. Truths and facts can only come in propositional form, and as such could have been delivered to Mary prior to her release.
This is not to say that she doesn’t learn anything upon her release. Instead, what she learns upon her release does not consist in any new facts or truths, only experiences. Again, this is not an argument in favor of physicalism, but should only be read as a criticism of Jackson’s arguments against physicalism. He claims that physicalism cannot be true since new facts or truths are learned upon Mary’s release, and this is simply not necessarily the case.
It can still be argued, however, that nature of these propositions which describe what red is like would be meaningless to Mary while she had still never experienced red. This however is just as much a problem for Jackson as it is for my account. It is simply too easy to rely upon common intuition which suggests that Mary is learning new facts about “what red is like.” But what is red like? What is the fact of the matter? My position is that inasmuch as there is actually a fact of the matter, it can be learned by Mary while in captivity and inasmuch as there is not a fact of the matter then Jackson’s argument fails.
It is also tempting to respond by pointing out that a statements being meaningless to a person does not make the statement any less true or factual. However this line of thought would take us far from the topic at hand. Suffice it to say that even if propositional knowledge requires experiential knowledge for it to count as knowledge in any meaningful sense of the word, this does not entail that there is no difference between the two types of knowledge. It is this difference which is the important point which Jackson’s argument does not take into account.
(As a completely off-topic side note, it is a machines total lack of experiential knowledge which makes its syntactical manipulation of symbols completely lacking in semantic content. A computer can output statements about red all day, but these statements will never mean the same thing to the machine as it does to those of us who are not locked in Mary’s cell. Indeed, it is precisely because those outputs do mean something to us that we are willing to wrongfully attribute intelligence or consciousness to such a machine, and this is primary shortcoming of the Turing Test.)
Update:
In response to Richard's thoughtful comment below, I have had to slightly modify my position a bit. The modified position can be found here.
As a recap, Jackson’s knowledge argument is illustrated with the case of Mary the color scientist who is kept from experiencing any colors herself until her release. Jackson’s argument is as follows:
- “Mary (before her release) knows everything physical there is to know about other people.
- “Mary (before her release) does not know everything there is to know about other people (because she learns something about them on her release).
- “There are truths about other people (and herself) which escape the physicalist story.”
Rather than “knowledge that” as a label for the third person observation of a causal system, I will adopt the new label “propositional knowledge.” This is knowledge which can be called justified true belief. The label which I want to give to the first person participation in a causal system is “experiential knowledge.” It is my contention that this latter type of knowledge is not propositional in its nature, and as such involves nothing which could be considered a belief.
Accordingly, it makes no sense to judge experiential knowledge to be justified or not since it is not propositional in nature. Experiential knowledge can be neither true nor false, and as such does not constitute truths, falsehoods or facts. Clearly, Jackson’s (3) requires that the knowledge which Mary gains upon release contains truths of one kind or another, but this is exactly what a failure to distinguish propositional knowledge from experiential knowledge prevents one from recognizing.
Let us now present a variation on Jackson’s argument:
1’. Mary (before her release) has all propositional knowledge there is to have about other people’s experience of color.
2’. Mary (before her release) does not have all experiential knowledge there is to have about other people’s experience of color (because she gains experiential knowledge upon her release).
3’. There are no truths about other people’s experience of color which escape Mary before her release.
Now of course at this point every dualist will be cringing at the liberties which I have taken with Jackson’s argument. There are a number of areas which must be laid out in far greater detail. First, my argument requires that much of the propositional knowledge which is gained by Mary is non-physical in its nature, thus making my argument entirely beside the point. Second, can we really be sure that no propositional knowledge will be gained upon Mary’s release?
In order to approach the first concern, we must remember that Jackson’s argument is that physicalism cannot be true. Accordingly, my reply to Jackson’s argument is not intended to be an argument for physicalism so much as an argument that physicalism can possibly be true. Consequently, we can be allowed to operate under the assumption that physicalism is in fact true and that mental states are in fact identical to physical states.
In other words, assuming the truth of physicalism, Mary does indeed get to have access to all information regarding other people’s experience of color, including verbal reports. Indeed, assuming physicalism to be true, Jackson’s story would actually require that Mary have access to such reports in order for her to have a complete propositional knowledge of other people’s experience of color. Thus, Mary would indeed know what the experience of color was like in so far as such knowledge can be put in propositional form.
We are now in a position to address the second concern that, as Richard pointed out, “It seems intuitively clear that Mary learns a new fact, namely, what it is like to experience red. She learns that redness looks a certain way.” My response is that inasmuch as there are facts which can be learned, Mary could have learned them while still in captivity by some other medium. Truths and facts can only come in propositional form, and as such could have been delivered to Mary prior to her release.
This is not to say that she doesn’t learn anything upon her release. Instead, what she learns upon her release does not consist in any new facts or truths, only experiences. Again, this is not an argument in favor of physicalism, but should only be read as a criticism of Jackson’s arguments against physicalism. He claims that physicalism cannot be true since new facts or truths are learned upon Mary’s release, and this is simply not necessarily the case.
It can still be argued, however, that nature of these propositions which describe what red is like would be meaningless to Mary while she had still never experienced red. This however is just as much a problem for Jackson as it is for my account. It is simply too easy to rely upon common intuition which suggests that Mary is learning new facts about “what red is like.” But what is red like? What is the fact of the matter? My position is that inasmuch as there is actually a fact of the matter, it can be learned by Mary while in captivity and inasmuch as there is not a fact of the matter then Jackson’s argument fails.
It is also tempting to respond by pointing out that a statements being meaningless to a person does not make the statement any less true or factual. However this line of thought would take us far from the topic at hand. Suffice it to say that even if propositional knowledge requires experiential knowledge for it to count as knowledge in any meaningful sense of the word, this does not entail that there is no difference between the two types of knowledge. It is this difference which is the important point which Jackson’s argument does not take into account.
(As a completely off-topic side note, it is a machines total lack of experiential knowledge which makes its syntactical manipulation of symbols completely lacking in semantic content. A computer can output statements about red all day, but these statements will never mean the same thing to the machine as it does to those of us who are not locked in Mary’s cell. Indeed, it is precisely because those outputs do mean something to us that we are willing to wrongfully attribute intelligence or consciousness to such a machine, and this is primary shortcoming of the Turing Test.)
Update:
In response to Richard's thoughtful comment below, I have had to slightly modify my position a bit. The modified position can be found here.
Filed in: mind
Comments:
Hi Jeff,
Does knowing that "Mary (before her release) does not have all experiential knowledge there is to have about other people’s experience of color (because she gains experiential knowledge upon her release)." count as a propositional knowledge?
If yes, how do you account for it from physicalist standpoint?
Posted by Tanasije Gjorgoski
Does knowing that "Mary (before her release) does not have all experiential knowledge there is to have about other people’s experience of color (because she gains experiential knowledge upon her release)." count as a propositional knowledge?
If yes, how do you account for it from physicalist standpoint?
Posted by Tanasije Gjorgoski
Yes, it does count as propositional knowledge, and Mary would have known it before her release. Again, the point is not that I have to explain how a physicalist could account for it, for we simply get to assume that there is a physicalist explanation for it.
Posted by Jeff G
Posted by Jeff G
I have problems with any argument that starts out with a line like:
"1. Mary (before her release) knows everything physical there is to know about other people."
And yes, it does centre in the definition of the word "know". Suppose we substituted the simpler opening:
"1. Mary (before her meeting with Kurt Gödel) knows everything arithmetical there is to know about natural numbers."
You can see where points 2 and 3 would go.
Jackson's argument only sounds plausible if you don't think through what his first point entails. There's a sleight of hand in passing that knowledge off as "huge, but hypothetically possible", when "inconceivable" is a better description.
All his argument does is show that simplistic reductionism + hand waving doesn't work. Even when you know the rules that govern a physical system, you don't "know" everything physical there is to know, because there are interactions that produce behaviors that would still surprise you. That's not an argument against physicalism, it's an argument against the concept of completeness.
Posted by Virge
"1. Mary (before her release) knows everything physical there is to know about other people."
And yes, it does centre in the definition of the word "know". Suppose we substituted the simpler opening:
"1. Mary (before her meeting with Kurt Gödel) knows everything arithmetical there is to know about natural numbers."
You can see where points 2 and 3 would go.
Jackson's argument only sounds plausible if you don't think through what his first point entails. There's a sleight of hand in passing that knowledge off as "huge, but hypothetically possible", when "inconceivable" is a better description.
All his argument does is show that simplistic reductionism + hand waving doesn't work. Even when you know the rules that govern a physical system, you don't "know" everything physical there is to know, because there are interactions that produce behaviors that would still surprise you. That's not an argument against physicalism, it's an argument against the concept of completeness.
Posted by Virge
Mary learns that redness looks like ____ (insert phenomenal image of redness). Isn't that a fact that she couldn't know before her release?
Posted by Richard
Posted by Richard
My argument is that inasmuch as "redness looks like ___ (insert phenomenal image of redness)" is a proposition, she could have learned it before hand, and inasmuch as it is not, there is no new fact or truth which has been learned.
I deny that one can mix the phenomenal and the verbal in the sentence as you are doing. Either one is saying "redness looks like red" or "that thing which call 'redness' looks like this thing we call 'red.'" You sentence is simply dressed up to look propositional when in fact it is merely experiential in nature.
I know that I am simply reasserting what I already said in the post, but I can't think of any better way of addressing your point.
Posted by Jeff G
I deny that one can mix the phenomenal and the verbal in the sentence as you are doing. Either one is saying "redness looks like red" or "that thing which call 'redness' looks like this thing we call 'red.'" You sentence is simply dressed up to look propositional when in fact it is merely experiential in nature.
I know that I am simply reasserting what I already said in the post, but I can't think of any better way of addressing your point.
Posted by Jeff G
Well Richard, I have reconsidered your response and I agree that propositional knowledge probably is gained upon release. It's always nice to know that an entire post is absolutely worthless, especially when you've already submitted it to the Philosopher's Carnival. Perhaps you could do me the favor of cancelling that submission? Thanks. I address your response in yet another post.
Posted by Jeff G
Posted by Jeff G
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